O'Ryan: Hey there, my name's O'Ryan, and today I am joined by my two co hosts, Coach Noelle,

Noelle: Hey there.

O'Ryan: and Trina from MyLadyADHD.

Trina: Hello.

O'Ryan: Today we have a question from the community about diagnosis.

V: Hey, this is V from Oakland and I recently got diagnosed with ADHD. It's nice knowing what's going on and so many things make sense now, but I don't, I don't know what to do next. Where do I go from here?

Noelle: I think that is legitimately something that we have all experienced because I was late diagnosed and I think you guys both were too, right?

O'Ryan: Yeah, back in like 2019,

Noelle: Yeah. It's 2019 for me too.

Trina: Yeah I was close to there. Maybe 2020 or 2021?

Still new.

O'Ryan: just little babies

Trina: Yeah.

O'Ryan: For you, Noelle, what, what was that experience like?

Noelle: well, I was in my last. semester of grad school, and that's when I went to go get the assessment. And it, it's kind of funny, I think, thinking back that I got all the way to the last semester of grad school as a mental health counselor. And never before then was like, Hmm, maybe there's something going on here. and so it would have been nice to know I had ADHD any, any time before then, I think, but,yeah, I went and got the assessment and they were like, yep, here you got ADHD and here's some medication we'll see you later. And

O'Ryan: sounds about right. so prior to that, you're, you're going through school and you, you have no, no idea, were the symptoms there for you or what, what was going on?

Noelle: I think, looking back, I can see that the symptoms were totally there. But, I'm one of those people that I think, because at least I'm, you know, born as female. And because I always loved school, I enjoyed learning, I picked it up really quickly. It so was under the radar that no one picked up on it. But I know I was always the kid who was reading a book during class. the teachers would try and call on me to, you know, catch me out like, Oh, you're not paying attention. And they'd be like, Noelle, what is this? And I'd be like, Oh yeah, it's that. And they're like, fine, go back to your book.

O'Ryan: You're like, I am using this to stay focused.

Noelle: the

have to study because I would just read the book. And I, Enjoyed it. And I really picked up on it. I didn't need to study, things like that, that I think really flew under the radar and it was really only in grad school that I struggled a lot because, well, I started to struggle because it was. A lot more freedom than even undergrad. And especially towards the end, I was also going through a lot of really stressful, like personal life situations on top of it just really made it tough to finish all of my, my coursework. Yeah. I, I think it was after like a TikTok or something. a lot of people are experiencing these days, they see something that really sounds familiar and they're like, Hmm, I wonder.

Yeah the algorithm

O'Ryan: really does work.

Noelle: Yeah, for sure.

O'Ryan: Trina, what about you? You said you were also late diagnosed.

Trina: Yeah, I was diagnosed. so I had always really struggled at work. I always just assumed it was the job, but I was in the wrong job. So I job hopped a lot. I was always trying to, find the right fit. And finally, in like around 2020 2021, I was in a job that I thought was the perfect fit. It had the perfect hours, the perfect pay, the perfect, mission.

I was really, really loved the job, or so I thought I would love the job. but then I realized, no, I'm, I'm still struggling here. Like this is, this is the job that I should be able to be fine at and I'm still struggling. and I started having panic attacks. I started going to therapy to deal with the panic attacks and figure out what was wrong.

Like, why couldn't I be happy in this job? And I got really lucky because my therapist had ADHD she recognized it in me right away. It was like, I think you should, you know, maybe go and get a diagnosis for ADHD or get this looked at. and so that's very rare. I think, nowadays for,You know, well, maybe it's, maybe it's better now, but back then, it was, I was very lucky to find help that quickly, for ADHD, but at the time when I got diagnosed, I thought she was insane. I only had known men and boys with ADHD. I did not know any women with ADHD. And I flat out didn't believe them that I had ADHD. so I, I went online and I tried to find other women like me who had ADHD and I found a couple. but I started talking about it regularly on social media, just trying to find other women like me.

Cause I just didn't think there were that many of us. And then I started MyLadyADHD that way. And I found four women. a couple hundred thousand, women with ADHD. So they actually do exist. I just didn't believe it. And it took me quite a while to realize that, you know, women can have ADHD. yeah, so that's kind of why My Lady ADHD started was because it was after my own diagnosis.

O'Ryan: I was just trying to learn everything I could about it and connect with other women. and then here I am, still talking about it. I can't stop talking about it now,it's, you know, there are still women out there that don't know that they have ADHD. I love the, it's, it just learning in general was Noelle's hyperfixation all through early life and then you stumble across it because it like doesn't match the stereotype of what ADHD is. Right. And the same thing with you, Trina is like, no, like I'm not a hyperactive little boy bouncing off the walls.

that's not me.

Trina: Yeah, the only one, really what I was basing ADHD off of was in high school or middle school, I had this friend that always in every class sat next to me and his name was Willie, and he would tap on his, on the desk and he would, he was just, he kind of annoyed me all the time, but he was the only one I knew that had ADHD.

And he was always getting in trouble and he was distracting me from, I couldn't, he was, it was all I could focus on because I have ADHD. he was like the example of someone that had ADHD

O'Ryan: Hmm.

Trina: daydreaming in the classroom was what I was doing or, you know, and

O'Ryan: Yeah.

Trina: saw that represented in, in ADHD.

yeah. What about you? Oh, Ryan.

O'Ryan: I feel very similar to both of you, because I, I, I have primarily inattentive. And I wasn't, I wasn't hyperactive. I wasn't bouncing off the walls. I didn't have a ton of energy. I did find that as a kid, I was, I was super imaginative. And that was what I was known for, you know, being creative and imaginative.

I was also the late kid every single day. You know, I think I had detention almost every day of high school because I was late

Trina: Same.

O'Ryan: which which Kind of worked in my favor because you know, I looked like I looked like one of the bad boys, right? Because I was in detention all the time, but it was just because I was late Yeah, I felt that way when I was in high school at least looking back on it though.

Like I see so many of the signs And and it's interesting because To me, looking back, it's so clear. It's so clear that it was ADHD, but I find myself sometimes looking back and thinking if young O'Ryan knew what was going on, if he knew what I knew now and could actually take advantage of those situations back then, like what could have been different?

And I feel, I'm curious because I feel, I feel like this is probably a pretty common occurrences. There's this moment of trying to understand what's going on with my life and then realizing, Oh, it's been this the whole time. And you look back and there's this like guilt and anger and all these emotions kind of attached to it I'm curious for you two what was that experience like for you receiving that diagnosis.

Trina: Such a rollercoaster. yeah, I think the rollercoaster of emotions through the diagnosis process is pretty, it's similar for people, but it's also, it can be very different. mine was very much wow, light bulb moment, I can't believe like all of these answers to all of these things I've been struggling with, like all boiled down to one thing. and that was really amazing to me, oh, everything I can explain, like why I've struggled in college and why relationships have been hard and,I think it can start out as Oh, I'm, I'm so glad I have answers. And then it kind of turns to anger pretty quickly, or sadness over missed opportunities or, or mistakes that you've made and just looking back and kind of putting the pieces together. I think that's really common. I've discussed this a lot with, with people who are newly diagnosed with ADHD, especially if you're diagnosed as an adult. look, the looking back and, and wondering, you know, what might have been different. I think, I think that's very common.

O'Ryan: How about you, Noelle?

Noelle: Yeah. I mean, that's exactly how, what, how it was for me. I, I can still feel that sort of weight that lifted when I found out. And I was like, Oh, okay. There's a name for what I'm experiencing. There's a thing that I can. Do what I do and jump into the research and figure it out. my original, like specialty, whenever I was in, grad school was going to be OCD and anxiety.

And I still love learning about it and treating it, ADHD became the thing and it is still my hyper focus,five years later because it was so fascinating. But yeah, after that initial weight lifted and, and I understood it, and then within a month or two, I graduated and the last bit of structure from school fell away.

And suddenly I was responsible for myself you know, completing case notes on time and doing all the things that you have to do to be a therapist. And I was struggling hard. I,I had a lot of, of really tough and,so that's why I started kind of doing all this research and figuring out, okay, know there's a lot of support for children.

But I've never seen anyone who helps adults with this. And that's why I started my practice here in St. Louis, because I, somebody needed to do it. But then I started looking back and I'm like, Oh my gosh, if I had known about this earlier, what if I didn't have to struggle with this? You know, if I, what if I. Had been able to handle my, my case notes and all the admin work. Would I be a therapist now instead of a coach? I have stuck with that? would I have not lost the job I lost back in 2013 because head was in the clouds and I couldn't, you know, focus and pay attention enough. And that was a traumatic experience being fired for the first time. First and only time, but yeah, it like so many experiences that I wonder, did I have to struggle like that? And it's really frustrating.

O'Ryan: you hear a lot in the ADHD community, the, the light bulb moment, right? The receiving your diagnosis or even just being on TikTok in the middle of a doom scroll, on your couch and being called out very specifically and very directly and having that light bulb moment of, Oh, I do have ADHD.

I like that, that metaphor, because that's exactly what it felt like for me. It felt like I was bumbling around in a dark room. Like hitting my shins on furniture, falling all the time and realizing that other people are walking around their rooms fine. Like they, they don't seem like they're bumping into stuff and falling down, but then somebody turned the light on and suddenly I can see the furniture and yeah, it's still a mess, but like I can see the furniture now, right?

I can, I can avoid hitting my shins on the chair or now I can recognize, okay, this chair actually does need to be in the kitchen. Right. I'm curious when

I, when I look back at my experience, I see a lot of what you're talking about where I had a lot of structure when I was a kid. And even as, as a teen, I had a lot of structure, but then that moment where I left my parents house and I was out on my own, I was suddenly responsible for all of my own stuff. I feel like that's when it really started to kick in.

It wasn't just about being late to school anymore. It wasn't just about forgetting my homework. It was now like, Oh, I didn't pay my electric bill. I don't have electricity. I forgot to order heat, right? Like I have to order oil every month. What, what the heck is that? And I suspect that that's kind of what's going on for a lot of folks is that you have that guardrail all through your young life.

That kind of sets you up to like your parents, maybe take on more structure for you to accommodate without knowing what's going on. And then once you leave the household, now you're on your own and you're trying to figure it out. And then the problems start. And I feel like that's where we get back into the shame stuff that we talked about last time.

And then that forces you to hide for a long time. And then You get called out, maybe you find a therapist who's awesome and has ADHD or maybe your TikTok tells you you have ADHD.

What happens next?

We have the lights on, we can see that the house is organized differently than everybody else's house.

What next?

Noelle: Oh, this is a thing. Let me learn everything there is to know about it in the next 10 minutes. and that's kind of what I did. the first resource that I found that I will always love was how to ADHD by Jessica McCabe. And her videos made everything make so much sense. It was relatable. It was easy to understand.

And, and as I was learning from her. doing like more of the scientific research. I'm like, okay, I've got like the basics, the knowledge down now, I need to figure out how to apply it. And I think I first started with therapy, which is always, I think a great place to start because that's where you're going to deal with a lot of those, those emotions, the, the shame and figuring out like. and how much of that have I been doing? And can I, can I stop? and the anger too, at past teachers and at parents and all the people that you feel like you should have, you should have seen this, you should have been there to help me and they weren't. you know, we know as adults, like they did the best they could.

O'Ryan: Yeah, yeah.

Noelle: it, but still feel angry. and you know, therapy is a great place to start to sort of unpack all of those emotions and, distance yourself from that shame. But then what my experience was, and just about every single client that I have seen in the past five years, you get to a certain point in therapy, usually after six months or so, where it's okay, that's it. I've unpacked all my emotions are kind of there. I can see them still deal with them, but you know, I understand them now. How do I pay my bills on time? How do I,you know, remember my keys are? How do I do the daily living? And that's where therapy fails, just because. Having been to school for therapy.

I know that is not something that we typically will learn about It's something that maybe maybe school therapists will learn about but if you're in the clinical track We don't learn anything about that. You have to do additional training after school and so a lot of people are going to therapy and their therapists aren't even recognizing they have ADHD because they They don't know anything about it. and so the therapist, you know, can give you the few basic tools, but unless they've had specific training on ADHD, they may not know how to help you. And so I think the next step after therapy is going to be some coaching. And that's where we kind of pick up with coaching is, okay, on a daily basis, what are the skills and tools and strategies and how do I fit them into my life?

O'Ryan: I feel like Jessica McCabe is so inextricably involved ,

in so many of us late diagnosis, ADHDer's lives, because for a lot of us, that was okay, let me sit down and figure out what this ADHD thing is. So you Google or you go on YouTube and you're right. Her videos were so , she comes from a place of nonjudgment and she just clearly explains and she makes everything so accessible.

yeah. super thankful to Jess McCabe. Your videos are amazing. I'm curious, something that I've been thinking about a lot is coaching. Obviously, I feel like I'm finally at a place where I'm ready to do coaching. And I know Trina, you've been doing it for a little while. obviously, Noelle, you've been doing it for a while. For me, I know, I know that the main hangup for me around coaching is just this idea of somebody telling me what to do.

My demand avoidance kicks in. It's like being accountable to another person. I'm like, ah, I have too many things on my plate right now. I can't deal with another thing. Having all these commitments is already too much. I'm starting coaching literally this week. I'm curious how does this process work?

And what does it look like for somebody who's just starting?

Noelle: do you want to talk about what your experience was first, like when you started?

Trina: Because I also struggle with that, I don't like being told what to do at all. but I also recognize in me that I need accountability to a certain degree.

O'Ryan: Yeah.

Trina: And I, instead of looking at it from that lens of being told what to do, I kind of look at my coach as more accountability. because that's, that is what I need.

I need, I need someone to Check in on me and make sure I'm doing what I said I'm going to do or,you know, and I can, it's up to me what, that accountability is. You know, I'm the one that's guiding that in this, in a certain degree. if I really want to focus on, know, more time with my daughter this week and I need to remember that and I need help putting that on the calendar and I need to figure out how to fit that into my life. Then my coach is like there to help me with that and it's not solely on me anymore And I think that's the part that's really helpful is I think we already are carrying so much and we you know the mental load of having ADHD is a lot and just having another person there to back you up and give you ideas and that's what I get out of coaching.

I don't I think it's different for a lot of people I think Sometimes I come into my coaching session just needing to vent and talk and, get a little unquote therapy session out of it. and that's also really helpful for me, but, I think the accountability is more, I try to look at it from that lens instead of the don't tell me what to do. so I encourage you to go into it with that mindset because I, I think you probably do need accountability, cause it is something that. A lot of us struggle with.

O'Ryan: Yeah. Yeah. No, I do. I do.

Trina: I'm not calling you out, but I have a feeling that

O'Ryan: It sure feels like it.

Trina: Yeah. But also, for example, last week my goal was to like, okay, I'm gonna go down, I have a gym at my, in my building, and I, I, I need to just step my foot into the building three times this week.

O'Ryan: I don't even have to do anything there, just go down to the building, walk around, make sure I go down there, but I got the flu last week. So I had this big plan that I had worked out with my coach of how I was going to accomplish this and then life hit me and I wasn't able to go down even even go down to the gym. but I have a coach to, walk me through that and not beating myself up over it anymore when I typically would have, even being sick, I probably would have beat myself up over that. just having a coach to, remind me,need to take care of yourself. has been really helpful for me. Is it, is it kind of just that externalizing some of those executive functions around You know, because we can get, we can get really hung up in that spiral of planning and researching and prepping and, oh my gosh, I can't go to the gym because I have to do this and I have to do that. And if I go to the gym, that means I need to take a shower so that I look presentable.

And it's just this.

Trina: helps me with the minimizing the spiral that

O'Ryan: Hmm.

Trina: me. just, let's just cut that part out of the equation and,

O'Ryan: Yeah.

Trina: then kind of stops me in my tracks when I start spiraling and helps me get back. on a straight path because I tend to spiral. I do have anxiety, so I catastrophize everything. It's nice to have a sane voice that's you know, your thoughts aren't real, the things that you're saying aren't true. That's not, you know,

O'Ryan: Yeah.

Trina: a reminder at least once a week to be nice to myself.

O'Ryan: Hmm.

Trina: have that otherwise, so it's very helpful for me.

O'Ryan: Okay. I definitely need to coach. I definitely need some coaching.

Trina: Yeah.

Noelle: I think that, you know, for those who with that, I mean, that kind of person who I want you to tell me what to do, please tell me what to do at all times. I don't want to make decisions, but if that is a thing, you know, about yourself, whenever you're first looking for a coach, that's definitely something to. Ask them about and say, Hey, have you worked with people who struggle with that, demand avoidance? And if so, how do you help them with it? Because not every coach is necessarily going to know how to deal with that. But,think a coach who has experience with that will be able to help you come up with the goals and, make it feel like you're the one. Who is, you know, they're not telling you what to do. You're deciding what it is to do and when you're going to do it by and all that. they're just there to kind of like, check in on you. I like the idea of, a analogy of You know, at like water parks, there's the, the lazy river and you're kind of like, you know, drifting along, you're doing your thing, but every now and then there's the jets that kind of give you a little bit of a push. kind of how I see coaching. It's kind of like, you're doing your thing, you're swimming, the coach is there to give you those little pushes on a regular basis to keep it going. And to just make it a little easier than swimming out in the lap lane with no assistance.

Trina: Yeah, that's a good point because one thing I noticed with my coaching is that I tend to be very in the moment and present and I don't think a lot about goals or future or

O'Ryan: Hmm.

Trina: want to accomplish. And so having a coach also helps me to be like, wait,What, what, what am I trying to do here? what, where's the next step for me?

Because I find myself very stagnant, I guess, just trying to survive most of the time. And so having a coach also will help, I think, with those pushes to remind you like that you do have goals and that, you know, what, and help you figure out what those are. If you don't know what they are. I think it's really important for people with ADHD because a lot of us do live very in the moment.

we, we're not tend to be the best. At setting goals or, you know, keeping it, keeping your eye on the prize.

Noelle: They're remembering they exist.

Trina: Yeah. Yeah.

O'Ryan: I feel like as someone who has recently decided, okay, I'm going to do the coaching thing. and I'm sure there are some listeners out there that are maybe in the same place. If. If I'm looking for a coach, what, what are the things that I should be looking out for? Because I know one of the things that I got tripped up on early on is this whole idea of a coach sounds like a life coach.

And you know, that whole industry can sometimes be kind of predatory and unqualified. I'm curious about when I'm thinking about finding an ADHD coach specifically, what are the, what are some of the things that I should be looking for?

Noelle: Yeah. I mean, I think that it is something that the industry still struggles with a lot of kind of saying no ADHD coaching is a legit thing. the problem with coaching is because there's not any standard licensing like there is for psychologists or

O'Ryan: Mhm.

Noelle: that's. anyone can start a website later today and say, yeah, I'm a coach. but when it comes to, you know, whenever you're reaching out to coaches and trying to figure out, is this person going to be a good fit for me, you want to ask them some things about their education. You know, maybe I think a lot of ADHD coaches will actually have degrees in similar, you know, whether that's psychology or counseling or social work or something that gives them the actual helping skills versus someone who is just a life coach who, you know, maybe they've had experience in, in, in jobs, you know, maybe they've done training and stuff like

O'Ryan: Mhm.

Noelle: They have that, but maybe they don't have the actual education. and then ADHD coaches are also going to have ADHD specific training or, and, or experience. A lot of ADHD coaches also have ADHD, not all of them, but many of them. and we've probably done some kind of training, whether or not we got, you know, paid the ludicrous amount of money to get their certification for it. We've done some kind of training to learn how do we help others with ADHD. So ask about their education, their training, ask about, you know, for the things that you specifically want to work on, how have you helped other people this? what were some of the tools or strategies and what were your past clients results? and just see, does that sound like something to try? but ultimately I think when it comes to therapy or coaching, The number one thing, the, I guess the, the change factor, the thing that makes the most difference is the relationship you have with a coach. if you feel like this is a person I really jive with, that's going to be really important, just, just as much as fancy degrees.

O'Ryan: Obviously we're biased here cause we, we all work for Shimmer, but what do you think it makes Shimmer coaches different? What, what's so special about Shimmer and our coaches?

Noelle: I think there's a lot of things that really make it different. First of all, we're all here because we believe in making coaching accessible for people. was the original when Chris and Vic were first starting out and I was the first person that they brought on. That was how we connected was we want to make this accessible for people who can't pay thousands of dollars for ADHD coaching every month. so we're really passionate about making sure that people get the help they need. another thing that I think makes Shimmer different is that it's not like we have a standardized, every single coach has to coach in this specific way, which I think that it gives us the freedom as coaches to adapt to each client because every client with ADHD is so different. They're all experiencing completely different challenges and, they're at totally different places in their life. And being able to adapt like that and help each person in the way they need to be helped, is a, a, a big thing. I dunno, what, what have you two noticed in your time, I know you're both newer, To Shimmer, what have you noticed that you, you really like?

Trina: a couple things. I noticed the, I don't know if comradery is the right word, but I feel like the coaches have a community where they rely on each other also for. I guess education and help. And, they, it just seems like they are always trying to help one another and they really, truly do care about their clients. I find that to be very genuine, is something that I noticed before I ever started working with Shimmer,it felt like the coaches really doing it for the right reasons. So that's something that I do also experience from my coach. I feel like it's very genuine. I have a genuine, you know, camaraderie with my coach. Yeah, I do feel like Shimmer is different, because they were started by someone who had ADHD who was kind of struggling with this and looking for coaching and couldn't find coaching. and so just decided to start it themselves, which is so ADHD to me.

Noelle: Oh yeah.

Trina: and I just kind of love that story. so just the way that it started and the way that it continues to really be focused on actually helping people with ADHD feels very genuine.

that's, that to me does set it apart from maybe some other coaching services.

O'Ryan: Yeah, I totally agree. I, one of the things that drew me to Shimmer just, just as a,I'm going to stop being an entrepreneur and work for a company again was just the fact that like how passionate Chris and Vic were about this, but then also,just the level of effort that goes into making sure that we are bringing scientifically accurate information forward.

you know, a lot of what we're doing. Because we, we obviously work together and we are creating tons of content and resources and stuff like that. The, the amount of scrutiny and care that goes into making sure what we're saying is accurate, that it's actually backed by science, that it's, it's not something that's, pseudo science or, super woowoo , no, this is actually backed in research.

And we. We care about that because we want to make sure that this is effective. We don't want you to learn something that's going to set you back or maybe trip you up. that this is actually something that we know works and this is going to be helpful for other people to know.

Trina: Yeah, I mean and another like indicator is that I think most of us on the team are being coached. Like we all use the product or

O'Ryan: Yeah,

Trina: like on the regular, like we believe in it so much that we actually use it and we, we all, we need it. All of us need it probably and that's probably why, but. I think that's, that is pretty telling,

Community Spotlight: Hi, this is Eugene and you're listening to Brainwaves, your guide to all things ADHD, brought to you by Shimmer, the number one coaching platform for people with ADHD.

O'Ryan: Today, we talked about the rollercoaster of emotions that comes with getting diagnosed with ADHD, especially later in life. totally normal to feel that complex soup of relief, grief, and yes, even anger as you process. now seems obvious. And what could have been, had you known earlier? What matters most is what you do.

Next therapy can help you unpack the past and ADHD coaching can help guide you to building better strategies for the future. part is something that Shimmer can help you out with when you're ready. You'll find links to a whole bunch of additional resources and more if you're subscribed to the newsletter or

at Shimmer.care/brainwaves

if you have a question and want to be featured in a future episode, head over to Shimmer.care/brainwaves, where you'll be able to submit your audio questions as well as check out our past episodes. Until next time.

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